alexseanchai: Katsuki Yuuri wearing a blue jacket and his glasses and holding a poodle, in front of the asexual pride flag with a rainbow heart inset. (Default)
let me hear your voice tonight ([personal profile] alexseanchai) wrote2020-09-07 07:55 pm

CN JKR, Nazis (also how am I only hearing this part two months later)

Jul 8, [twitter.com profile] jk_rowling quote-tweeted someone who was distancing themself from JKR on the basis of JKR being transmisic

[twitter.com profile] bethanyshondark, whose bio point blank says she's a neo-Nazi, replied "You are the hero we needed."

[twitter.com profile] jk_rowling replied "You are the comfort I needed".



I thought it would be possible to hold on to the good bits of Harry Potter canon and sift out the parts rooted in JKR's transmisia and queermisia and antisemitism and

I think I was wrong.



ETA: apparently the reason I did not previously hear about this is because the other participant in this twitter thread is a Jewish TERF, not a Nazi (see [personal profile] seekingferret and [personal profile] jadelennox below)
conuly: (Default)

[personal profile] conuly 2020-09-08 03:15 am (UTC)(link)
:(
conuly: (Default)

[personal profile] conuly 2020-09-08 08:37 pm (UTC)(link)
Not much better, imo.
tptigger: (Default)

[personal profile] tptigger 2020-09-08 03:39 am (UTC)(link)
Ugh.
polyfrazzlemented: (Default)

[personal profile] polyfrazzlemented 2020-09-08 03:56 am (UTC)(link)
I've heard the story summarized as "Trust fund jock becomes a cop." For everything the story is, progressive is not it.
polyfrazzlemented: (Default)

[personal profile] polyfrazzlemented 2020-09-08 04:15 am (UTC)(link)
I was a fan. I still have some fondness for the story. I'm not trying to cast aspersions on you or anyone else for liking it.
polyfrazzlemented: (Default)

[personal profile] polyfrazzlemented 2020-09-08 05:00 am (UTC)(link)
<3
elf: Snape catches the snitch (Team Snitch: Reaching for Gold)

[personal profile] elf 2020-09-08 05:20 am (UTC)(link)
It is impossible to separate out the transphobia, the homophobia, the misogyny, the quasi-Nazi sentiments, the extreme heteronormativity, and the overt support of child abuse and neglect from the "good bits." What you'd be left with is fragments.

(I mean. Fragments is enough to build fanfic empires, and some people have. But some of us like a bit more canon in our fic than that.)

Rowling has fallen into that pit where she believes everyone critical of her work or her public statements is anti-woman, anti-poor (because nevermind where she is now; she started poor), anti-creativity. And that's not going to change because she's never going to take a break long enough to perceive the arguments from a different perspective.

Other than that... the books themselves are packed with cliche tropes which is why they caught on so well. Mass popularity does not come from groundbreaking, innovative work; it comes from works that resonate with millions of people who agree on nothing but "wouldn't it be awesome if everyone married their high school sweethearts and they stayed married for life."

I don't blame anyone for liking it. I haven't sorted out my own level of "like." But the problematic starts early in the series and just never lets up. The only reason it works at all, is that it's told from a young, unreliable narrator POV--once Rowling speaks up and starts confirming details, that's lost.
sylvaine: Dark-haired person with black eyes & white pupils. ([HP] shipping them forever)

[personal profile] sylvaine 2020-09-08 05:32 am (UTC)(link)
Oooh, last part is a really good point.
elf: Snape catches the snitch (Team Snitch: Reaching for Gold)

[personal profile] elf 2020-09-08 05:59 am (UTC)(link)
I suspect a whole lot of why we all didn't drop the series as soon as the first wave of essays hit, going over, "hey this is... a bit problematic," is that the POV starts with a preteen boy who's been neglected to the point of abuse, lied to, and gaslit his entire life, and we could tell ourselves, "he doesn't really understand what's going on; he's interpreting it through the filter the Durselys have taught him." And because he's a preteen and then young teen boy with no sensible adult guidance, trying to understand a complex world of powerful machinations.

The more JKR gets involved with the storytelling, the harder it is for that to hold. But the sense of learning the story with the awareness of that filter sticks around. We don't remember the misogyny as much as we remember Harry's cluelessness.

Of course, by late in the story, JKR's limits as a writer started making themselves known. She kept talking about the importance of choice and then arranging the plot so that choice didn't matter. Talked about Harry being a hero but didn't let him do anything but show up - and he required a lot of help for that. So we're stuck trying to reconcile those contradictions - and we were better at coming up with coherent reasons for them than she was, because she didn't see them as contradictions at all.
polyfrazzlemented: (Default)

[personal profile] polyfrazzlemented 2020-09-08 07:09 am (UTC)(link)
I also think that by late in the story, her editors had stopped editing because they knew fans would eat up anything she wrote. The first three books are a lot tighter, and by the last book it reads like a bad fanfic.
duskpeterson: The lowercased letters D and P, joined together (Default)

[personal profile] duskpeterson 2020-09-08 08:27 pm (UTC)(link)
"The more JKR gets involved with the storytelling, the harder it is for that to hold."

You know, this is one reason I'm reluctant to interpret my own stories to readers. I don't want my all-too-fallible self coming between my readers and their enjoyment of my characters.
worlds_of_smoke: A picture of a brilliantly colored waterfall cascading into a river (Default)

[personal profile] worlds_of_smoke 2020-09-08 09:14 am (UTC)(link)
I feel infinitely blessed that I never got into HP because I can't imagine how this feels for people who grew up adoring HP.
worlds_of_smoke: A picture of a brilliantly colored waterfall cascading into a river (Default)

[personal profile] worlds_of_smoke 2020-09-08 09:35 pm (UTC)(link)
Not much better, IMO. TERFs are only different than Nazis because of the particular class of people they want to eliminate.
chanter1944: Commander Seth Goddard of Space Cases fame (SC - Goddard: do the best they can)

[personal profile] chanter1944 2020-09-08 01:08 pm (UTC)(link)
I'm trying to assume that JKR didn't read the profile info of the person she was replying to, just responded to the tweet. Bad enough.
silveradept: A kodama with a trombone. The trombone is playing music, even though it is held in a rest position (Default)

[personal profile] silveradept 2020-09-08 02:56 pm (UTC)(link)
I suspect JKR and HP Lovecraft will eventually occupy the same general space as having a mythos and a setting that people will riff on and make allusions to and write fix-its for in their own works, but that everyone who goes into that space will do so knowing the author is ultra-problematic.
seekingferret: Two warning signs one above the other. 1) Falling Rocks. 2) Falling Rocs. (Default)

[personal profile] seekingferret 2020-09-08 03:38 pm (UTC)(link)
I don't like Mandel very much at all, but she's an observant Jew and not a Neo-Nazi, the twitter bio is a bad attempt at irony.
jadelennox: Senora Sabasa Garcia, by Goya (Default)

[personal profile] jadelennox 2020-09-08 08:20 pm (UTC)(link)
yeah, this. She has been called a neo Nazi by a lot of people -- she's center right and an apologist for a lot of terrible bullshit -- and she's trying to be snide. Like the grandma killer thing, which came from her making an awful joke-not-a-joke-no-jk-just-a-joke saying she didn't care if breaking quarantine killed grandmothers, she needed to get her kids out of the house.

She'd bad at humor, the internet, and basic human empathy, but she is emphatically not a Nazi. She's a shitty transphobic center right Jew, that's all.
tptigger: (Default)

[personal profile] tptigger 2020-09-08 08:47 pm (UTC)(link)
A Jew who fails at (bad transliteration alert:) p'kayach nefesh.

So that's.... still icky, but....

IDK. I refuse to give Rowling more money, but the fandom and books have given me too much joy to trash everything.
swingandswirl: text 'tammy' in white on a blue background.  (Default)

[personal profile] swingandswirl 2020-09-09 10:50 am (UTC)(link)
Maybe I'm a bad person, but I just can't let HP go, and I'm relieved to hear that the person wasn't a Nazi, just a TERF. (Not that TERFs don't deserve to be yeeted into the sun, but it's a prejudice I'm aware JKR has versus it being a new one, you know?)

/sighs/ Oh JKR. Why couldn't you just take your money and SHUT UP like a lot of other terrible people.